Council of Warriors
Posts: 924
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Change Name of Roman Republic 10.01.2011 01:35:26 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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Locum: Consul
Archon: Princeps Senatus
Protector: Praetor
Warrior: Legionary
Crest: SPQR Eagle (if this change possible - Marcus Aurelius will, as a historian, provide the adequate crest)
Denis CicicPrinceps Senatus of Roman Republic, General of Legio IV Scythica Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 10.01.2011 04:55:58 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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Denis, first some references are need it. I did some legwork for you:
Princeps Senatus
QUOTE: The princeps senatus (plural principes senatus) was the first member by precedence of the Roman Senate. Although officially out of the cursus honorum and owning no imperium, this office brought enormous prestige to the senator holding it.
The princeps senatus was not a lifetime appointment. He was chosen by every new pair of censors (that is, every 5 years). Censors could, however, confirm a princeps senatus for a period of another 5 years. He was selected from patrician senators with consular rank, usually former censors. The successful candidate had to be a patrician with an impeccable political record, respected by his fellow senators.
Originally, the position of the princeps was one of honor: he had the privilege of speaking first on the topic presented by the presiding magistrate. This gave the position great dignitas as it allowed the princeps to set the tone of the debate in the Senate. In the late Republic and in the Principate, the office gained the prerogatives of the presiding magistrates and additional powers, namely:
* Summoning and adjourning the Senate
* Deciding its agenda
* Deciding where the session should take place
* Imposing order and other rules of the session
* Meeting, in the name of the Senate, with embassies of foreign countries
* Writing, in the name of the Senate, letters and dispatches
(Wiki)
Consul
QUOTE: During the Roman Republic, the consuls were the highest civil and military magistrates, serving as the heads of government for the Republic. New consuls were elected every year. There were two consuls and they ruled together. (Wiki)
QUOTE: Consul: Roman magistrate, comparable with a prime minister or a president.
The oldest and most important magistracy was the consulship, which can best be described as a dual prime ministership or presidency.
The consuls served for only one year (to prevent corruption) and could only rule when they agreed, because each consul could veto the other one's decision.
The consuls were the chairmen of the Senate, which served as a board of advisers. They also commanded the Roman army (both had two legions) and exercised the highest juridical power in the Roman empire.
Praetor
QUOTE: Praetor was a title granted by the government of Ancient Rome to men acting in one of two official capacities: The commander of an army, usually in the field, or the named commander before mustering the army; and an elected magistratus (magistrate) assigned varied duties (per the historical period).
They act first as generals and judges, then as provincial governors.
Livy explains that in the year 366 BC the praetura was created to relieve the consuls of their judicial duties. The praetor was, in English, the chief justice, and yet more than that. The consuls were his peers; he was elected by the same electorate and sworn in on the same day with the same oath. With them he retained the ius militiae. (Wiki)
Legionary
QUOTE: The Roman legionary was a professional soldier of the Roman army after the Marian reforms of 107 BC. Legionaries had to be Roman citizens under the age of 45. They enlisted in a legion for twenty-five years of service, a change from the early practice of enlisting only for a campaign. The last five years were on veteran lighter duties. (Wiki)
Do not throw the arrow which will return against you!
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 10.01.2011 05:02:41 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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Second, it seems the Council of Warriors is back in place and the final form of the proposal should be submitted to them in the Petitions board.
Hoern wrote:
QUOTE: Normally it is for the Council to decide the titles....
...and then for the Tech-Mods or someone of the Council to inform me....
I must say that your proposal it seems to me very accurate, as the references shows.
Do not throw the arrow which will return against you!
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 10.01.2011 05:07:05 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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About the crest, not only a model (link) is need it. Somebody must do the graphics in the way Hoern can implement it.
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Council of Warriors
Posts: 924
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 20.01.2011 02:09:33 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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ok, then, can you please Siegfrid put this matter in front of the council for vote (all but the crest which me and MArcus Aurelius will work on) since we already use these names internaly:
Locum: Consul (both male and female -no beraterin)
Archon: Princeps Senatus
Protector: Praetor
Warrior: Legionary
Denis CicicPrinceps Senatus of Roman Republic, General of Legio IV Scythica Si vis pacem, para bellum
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 20.01.2011 09:29:27 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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to be honest, at our time the ruler of Rome should be called
praetor maximus or consul (or if you want to show that one is higher call him prae consul)
and than the consuls
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Council of Warriors
Posts: 1069
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 20.01.2011 22:50:18 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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I apologize you all for my late reply, specially Denis, who told me some time ago about this question, but he knows I am usually short of time and I need some to be able to write properly in English.
I think the best I can do to defend this proposal is to tell you its origin. Maybe some of you still remember Ildico's coup d'etat in Rome some time ago, and our civil war against her attempt to change our Republic into an Empire. The outcome of that war was a compromise between ancient republican romans and those who still followed Ildico's orders.
After signing peace between us, I myself was in charge of drafting a new Constitution for Rome, which finally was voted and approved by all Romans of that time, and it's still in use in our Republic, published in our Forum for every new roman to be able to read it.
The titles Denis presented here are current names for those offices used internally in our forums and comunications. I know they aren't completely accurate historically, but this is a Game, and its mechanics and structure make a bit difficult to achieve a complete historical exactitude.
As Aurich has said, my main problem regarding this point was the leader, because the Game allows only to have one "king" in a tribe (RL Romans always had "collegiate offices" in the Republic). I could have elected the title of Dictator, but I prefered not because of its current connotations and the opposition of the Romans who had just faced Ildico.
As Aurich points out, in early republican times, just after the overthrown of the Monarchy in RL Rome, there was a single office governing the Republic called "Praetor Maximus" (although this title and its powers are still historically discussed). Nevertheless I prefered to avoid it, given its short historical life and because of my use of the title Praetor for governors office. Sigfried has already pointed some information about, but to give you some data first roman governors for provinces out of Italy in the Republic were Praetores.
So, due to the limited powers of our leader in the new Constitution, I prefered to choose "Princeps Senatus" title to call this office. Sigfried has already included up some information about this office/title and its historical powers.
Those are our reasons for claiming the changes Denis asked for... I will include a post with our Constitution if you want to read it and clarify your ideas.
Marcus Aurelius
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Re:Change Name of Roman Republic 21.01.2011 00:01:44 --- 1 Year, 4 Months ago
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I think we wait enough for opinions and taking in consideration the references produced, in my opinion the titles from the proposal are accurate.
Since no major objections was made, I will submit the proposal to CoW for voting.
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